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The Stuff of Grace
 Shovel Shack : The Stuff of Grace
Subject Topic: So is He really ’in control’?
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Rayray
Digger
Digger


Joined: Jul-11-04
Location: United Kingdom
Posts: 28
Posted: Jul-24-04 at 12:30am | IP Logged  

ok..hi everyone, been mulling this one over for a bit...be cool to know your thoughts on the matter.

On the premise that God has done something about sin...he didnt just sit back and go "ah well, that whole create the universe thing kinda backfired" implies that God is an active, being, doing person.

......But is he actually 'in control'...ie, does he act and react to events or happenings with his creation or is it more of a 'set the wheels in motion, provide a way to experience true life and union with the Him....but the actual events etc of this world are merley cause and effect'...

as a side note I think I believe he is in control....I guess Im just questioning to what extent he exercises this power.

Be great to hear of any experiences you might of all had or not along these lines.

 

Cheers all

 

Ray

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Peter
Extreme Digger
Extreme Digger


Joined: Dec-31-01
Location: United States
Posts: 475
Posted: Jul-24-04 at 7:00am | IP Logged  


as a side note I think I believe he is in control....I guess Im just questioning to what extent he exercises this power.


Howdy Ray.  You don't have to look any further than the cross of Jesus to understand to what extent HE exercises HIS power. 


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the shovel
Shackmeister
Shackmeister


Joined: Oct-01-01
Location: United States
Posts: 4187
Posted: Jul-24-04 at 7:04am | IP Logged  

Peter wrote:


Howdy Ray.  You don't have to look any further than the cross of Jesus to understand to what extent HE exercises HIS power. 




Peter ... that is a most excellent consideration!!  Thank you. 

Love, Jim


      

DIGGIN'THE LIFE!
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Rayray
Digger
Digger


Joined: Jul-11-04
Location: United Kingdom
Posts: 28
Posted: Jul-25-04 at 5:04pm | IP Logged  

 

Yeah I know what you mean but I cant help but wonder why He lets people die of starvation, children get killed in wars etc. Why doesn’t he exert His control here and help these people out?

 

I feel soooo guilty sometimes living in my western world with all its comforts and self actualising…talking to God about stuff like my emotions, relationships etc…seems kinda an insult to those poor people in the rest of the world for me to be doing this…Why doesn’t He help these people?...it seems like such a huge injustice!

 

I know this isnt original though by any throw of the dice....but I guess the reality of the world I live in is hitting me more and more as I get older.

 

:)

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Buddy
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Joined: Aug-19-03
Location: United States
Posts: 310
Posted: Jul-25-04 at 6:29pm | IP Logged  

Rayray,

What if God is not in control ?  What if he loves us and all the horrible things of this world were and are not his intent ?  Does he love you any less and would you love him any less ?

Some things to ponder,

BUddy

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Rayray
Digger
Digger


Joined: Jul-11-04
Location: United Kingdom
Posts: 28
Posted: Jul-25-04 at 7:49pm | IP Logged  

Thanks Buddy…yeah that is a good point…If God loves all equally and more than we could even comprehend then I guess its fair to say he will be all things to all people regardless of where they fit of the hardship/sickness/poverty/hurt/physical scale….hmmmm yeah definably good point! Still, the world is a pretty ‘fd’ up place and its sometimes hard to understand why God doesn’t just go ‘right no more……Im fixing this right now!!......must be so hard for him to see the mess his creation is in right now…man that must be almost unbearable….imagine how it must be loving the world so much and having to watch as it self-destructs!!

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mcdave
Shackaddict
Shackaddict


Joined: Dec-25-01
Location: United States
Posts: 1809
Posted: Jul-25-04 at 9:25pm | IP Logged  

 Hi Ray and welcome to the shack.A thought to add.What if it is OUR perception of "bad" things that is colored?   there is much evil,pain and death in the world.But,what if,because we are looking at life through the eyes of time and our being limited because we have a physical body,that  we don't see the whole picture.   bad things happen and i personally believe that God allows things, good and bad to happen. but  because he is looking at things through the eyes of eternity,he sees the end of evil and the fulfillment of what his son did taking away ALL sin and all pain.we are living in the moment,in time. He is at the beginning and end of time ,seeing the conclusionof all pain and suffering.   three verses to ponder two  in the "now"another at the end of time  to show where i am heading with this.

"present"   2 Corinthians 4:15All this is for your benefit, so that the grace that is reaching more and more people may cause thanksgiving to overflow to the glory of God.
16Therefore we do not lose heart. Though outwardly we are wasting away, yet inwardly we are being renewed day by day. 17For our light and momentary troubles are achieving for us an eternal glory that far outweighs them all. 18So we fix our eyes not on what is seen, but on what is unseen. For what is seen is temporary, but what is unseen is eternal
.

 "Future"
 Revelation 7:16Never again will they hunger;
       never again will they thirst.
   The sun will not beat upon them,
       nor any scorching heat.
    17For the Lamb at the center of the throne will be their shepherd;
       he will lead them to springs of living water.
   And God will wipe away every tear from their eyes."

 to be honest,i believe that as believers in Christ,we are presently seated with Christ,out of time. we are with him past, present, and future.but i also know ,that i do not know why seemingly bad things happen other than to in time give him the glory.

  John 9:1As he went along, he saw a man blind from birth. 2His disciples asked him, "Rabbi, who sinned, this man or his parents, that he was born blind?"
3"Neither this man nor his parents sinned," said Jesus, "but this happened so that the work of God might be displayed in his life.

 

 Is he in "control"? absloutely.do we as created beings know what that entails?no.only in that as we seek to see Christ as all in all will we see him even when bad things happen to innocent people.until then we see as through a glass darkly.



Edited by mcdave on Jul-25-04 at 9:35pm


      

     It's not works,it's coffee.
   

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BobB
Shackaholic
Shackaholic


Joined: Mar-03-04
Location: Canada
Posts: 563
Posted: Jul-29-04 at 8:52pm | IP Logged  

Hi McDave!

I like the scriptures you used. This is probably the most asked question in history (suffering) and how often we are unprepared to give the answer.

Bob



      

friend of sinners
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luvin
Shackaddict
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Joined: May-20-02
Location: United States
Posts: 5235
Posted: Jan-02-11 at 10:45am | IP Logged  

Dave , excellent thoughts on God's "control".

      

It is peace[the kind we long for] to know that my life patterns do not distract or derail the Living God"-Adam

http:newthatsliving.blogspot.com
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