Surfing on life banner
The ShovelShack Archives
Between January 2002 and December 2011, almost 46,000 posts were created by members of the Shovel Shack discussion group.
In 2012, the Shovel Shack moved to a new home: shovelshack.org. Shovelshack.net will be kept intact as an archive for those amazing discussions.

Browse a bit and then join us at ShovelShack.org

Real Life in Christ
 Shovel Shack : Real Life in Christ
Subject Topic: the life of christ as an agenda?
Author
Message << Prev Topic | Next Topic >>
Dignz
Shackaddict
Shackaddict


Joined: Jul-18-06
Location: United States
Posts: 1816
Posted: Jun-16-11 at 12:20pm | IP Logged  

agendas with ourselves, agendas with one another, agendas amongst group gatherings, etc. ... whatever they may be .... i found the following from theshovel.net  so refreshing and thought provoking this morning!  great stuff really!  

"To determine the right agenda so that it can be nurtured is a bogus concept.

When you say that we all have an agenda, you are being too kind. :) The fact is that all of us have too many agendas. The fallacy is our assumption that the life of Christ is numbered among those agendas. It establishes that as long as I am offering Christ to others that I am offering the true or correct agenda that needs to be nurtured. Hence the doctrinal approach ... .  But we don't agree with that approach ... but we do ... but we don't ... but we do ... but we don't - ad infinitum. hahahaha!

When does doctrine become false? When the life of Christ is removed from the very words that are spoken, and the wording changes (or is reinterpreted) so that it can be supported from the Holy Writ.

Agendas ... I've got too many of them. Are we really to sort through to find the right agenda and nurture it? Or are we to look those agendas right in the face and let them all fall by the wayside so that we really have something to offer? Nobody needs any of my agendas!  I don't need any of my agendas. It is why I often stop and ask myself, 'Jim, what are you trying to offer here',  and  'what do you really have to offer here?'  It is the apostle Paul's conclusion that I continually come to,
For I determined to know nothing among you except Christ and him crucified. 1 Corinthians 2:2

I have no problem that people come in with agendas, for all who come in have many of them. For those who come in to get a rest from those agendas (though they are not aware of how many they still hold to) and to hear of Christ instead, is what this group has been about ... .

Those who come in with a DETERMINED agenda to undermine this is where I have the problem. And yes, I know that they THINK that they are doing God's will. I have a problem that we are afraid to call this for what it is. We are afraid to recognize that there are false brothers who sneak in to spy out our liberty in Christ and to bring us into bondage. I often hear the claim that we are mature enough to handle such a thing, but the fact is that this is exactly where we establish those little corners in our room where Christ has no effect ... those places where we are left in confusion. It is right here that we will conclude that Christ is an agenda, howbeit, the correct one. And it establishes another one of those fallacies in our thinking that if and when we finally understand this issue we will be free of it ... instead of resting in the reality that we are already free of it.

We are afraid that someone's potential of being overtaken by the reality of Christ might be snipped in the bud at such effrontery. I don't suggest the confrontation of doctrine ... and I hope you know that of me. I am referring to the fact that we have been given the mind of Christ and we are brought into the realm where we can judge all things. It is the simple stuff that we KNOW when somebody's words say one thing and it is so obvious that they merely use words to get their agenda in.

But we did not yield in subjection to them for even an hour, so that the truth of Christ might remain with you Galatians 2:5
How many hours do we have to wait before we call attention to a person's preaching of himself? Why are we afraid of it? Is it because we're afraid that many will think we are being ungracious as many did of Jesus and of Paul? Are we afraid that it will stifle and curtail others in their quest for truth?

We will find many of the same old issues popping up each time there are encounters with another self-preacher.  We may wonder why certain people are unable to deal with it and are shaken so easily. The heart of the problems will always be a diminishing of Christ in our perceptions. But it will sound like, 'Your truth is just as valid as my truth', or 'It is presumptuous to think we can KNOW', or 'How do we know that we're right and they are wrong?', etc, etc.

The worst thing in connection with a self-preacher is to have that preaching of themselves be raised to the level of their agenda vs. the agenda of CHRIST or that  your agenda and my agenda is the one that needs to be nurtured. No, no, no! Their agenda is no better than my agenda or yours because agendas are of the flesh - fleshly - while Christ is seated above in the heavenlies where we are hidden in God.

I know you really believe that. :) Don't let the fear that you might come across as if you believe your opinions are better than someone else's opinions put the life of Christ into the realm of opinion. Just because someone insists that the message of Christ is your opinion or your agenda don't listen to that and then find that you have to adjust the message of Christ as-you-preach-it to be merely the one that is more scriptural, or the one that works, or the one they like best, etc.

Love, Jim"

may we always preach Christ and Him crucified and our sufficiency and our all      



      

"afterall, he's not a tame lion"
Back to Top
 
luvin
Shackaddict
Shackaddict


Joined: May-20-02
Location: United States
Posts: 5235
Posted: Jun-16-11 at 12:55pm | IP Logged  

It's a great subject highlighting a very important
reality. I mean the powers that come against us are
not always so 'unflattering' as we might expect true
evil to come across. No, rather it/they are very
subtle and they/it use reason[natural] to slowly
pull us away from confidence in our Lord Jesus. WE
can not be moved but, our minds sure CAN. And that
is what happens quite often to those in Christ. We
will be pressured and mocked and threatened and
humiliated so that we will lay down and conform to
their empty reasoning. [The wisdom we grew up in,
the elemental world] Is it any different though than
what took place long ago? Shoot I remember people
crying out to have someone lay hold of Peter when
the Lord was captured for the purpose of condemning
him. They were greatly interested in getting him in
trouble so that he had to eventually deny Jesus
three times.What about Peter and Paul and the rest
of the Disciples? Did they not get shunned,
ridiculed, rejected, interrupted and even flattered?
Remember how they would beat them and then PLEAD
with them not to speak of Christ anymore? The
Disciples simply would not comply. They[the religious party] knew it too. They kept on
testifying to Life in Christ. All the usual games
and manipulations and threats and bullying didn't
work with them. They were familiar with this sort of
thing in the world and were not going to be thrown
off by it. The Lord Jesus strengthened them and they stood boldly according to Truth in the face of much
pressure and they had great joy in doing so. Had
they given in to a return to the thing the people
wanted them to give in to, they would have had to
forsake everything that was in them given to them by
Christ.

      

It is peace[the kind we long for] to know that my life patterns do not distract or derail the Living God"-Adam

http:newthatsliving.blogspot.com
Back to Top
 
Dignz
Shackaddict
Shackaddict


Joined: Jul-18-06
Location: United States
Posts: 1816
Posted: Jun-17-11 at 3:58pm | IP Logged  

i loved this especially, adam:   :)

"It's a great subject highlighting a very important reality. I mean the powers that come against us are not always so 'unflattering' as we might expect true evil to come across. No, rather it/they are very subtle and they/it use reason[natural] to slowly pull us away from confidence in our Lord Jesus."

and:

"The Lord Jesus strengthened them and they stood boldly according to Truth in the face of much
pressure and they had great joy in doing so."






      

"afterall, he's not a tame lion"
Back to Top
 

 



the shovel home page